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Bandit's EDIS OBDII 351w Build
- Thread starter BanditBronco
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BanditBronco
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Yes I have everything you need, send me a PM, I would like to keep my thread as build/tech oriented as possible. I really am at a stand still, being this close to finished but still that far away is burning me. Any input that anyone has is appreciated.
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BanditBronco
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Okay, so according to the tuner the logs I sent over didn't show any rpm change or voltage drop, so I am not sure what that is about. I did go ahead and check spark manually and injector pulse with a noid light. I don't have any spark, and I also don't have any injector pulse. The only weird thing was, sometimes when I was turning the key to the off position I was getting the noid light to come on for a quick second, like it was receiving voltage as I was moving the key from run to off. Looks like I got some digging to do.
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BanditBronco
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Okay so I have key on voltage to the injectors as well as both coil pack plugs. I checked crank sensor itself which showed about 351 Ohms, the new one also showed the same at rest ohm measurement. I haven't checked crank signal during cranking yet, as well as cam signal. From what I understand, crank signal is all the computer looks for to send spark signal. From what I understand as well, if it was a PATS problem in the tune, the check engine light would stay on while cranking. It comes on with key on, but goes out as it should when cranking.
One other thing I ran into, while I had the key on for a while doing some voltage testing, the alternator got really hot, you could still touch the top but the back was almost too hot to touch. Anyone have any experience with that? Is it normal for the alternator to get hot just key on?
One other thing I ran into, while I had the key on for a while doing some voltage testing, the alternator got really hot, you could still touch the top but the back was almost too hot to touch. Anyone have any experience with that? Is it normal for the alternator to get hot just key on?
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Alternator should not get warm at all.
Fix that asap. I have no helpful advice for spark other than crank signal which you say you've replaced with a new one and both ohm out the same. Have you replaced the EDIS module too? Quick and easy? I'd replace all sensors first while tracking each and every contact when doing that.
Best of luck figuring this out.
Fix that asap. I have no helpful advice for spark other than crank signal which you say you've replaced with a new one and both ohm out the same. Have you replaced the EDIS module too? Quick and easy? I'd replace all sensors first while tracking each and every contact when doing that.
Best of luck figuring this out.
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BanditBronco
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Still haven't quite nailed down the alternator issue.
I don't have an EDIS 8 module as this set up runs an explorer computer. All sensors are new or were working correctly on the previous swap. I plan on testing cam and crank signal this evening to see if I can track anything down.
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BanditBronco
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From what I can tell with a volt meter I am receiving correct crank signal to the computer. With the key on, I have 12v to both coils, when I turn the ignition to crank, I lose the 12v to the coils. Does anyone know how the neutral safety switch in the transmission range sensor works? If I put it in drive and try and start it, it still cranks. So what does the neutral safety switch kill and how does it kill it?
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BanditBronco
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Its a 4r70w, if the NSS pulls power from the starter then that seems odd that I can still get it to crank if I put it in drive and try and start it. Just because I have neither power to the coils or injector pulse only while cranking has me thinking I just have something mixed up. I figured I would just pick one and work with it first and see where it led me. If anyone can help me with all the reasons I could possibly not have spark and fuel at the same time, it might help me nail down some other things to check.
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Not sure about all the electronic pathways, but when a normally wired Bronco loses power to the ignition in START, it's always at the ignition switch itself.
You can check the output of the switch and see if the power disappears there or not. Only two wires come out of the single terminal location on the back of the switch that have power in both START and RUN.
In stock wiring form, these are the Green w/red and Red w/green wires. Not sure what color they might be with a different harness.
As said, a neutral safety switch's job is to stop the starter from cranking. Does not normally kill any ignition functions, but again I don't know about all the fancy modern stuff with 33 1/3 wires coming out of the switch on the trans. I can't count higher than four!
Do you still have a wire connected to the "I" post on the starter relay? Do you even have an I post? Modern relay/solenoids do not utilize one, but if you're still using the old style that came with the Broncos it would still be there. You can always make sure it's disconnected so that it can't possibly interfere with spark.
Depends on how yours is wired up, but if it's there then I would disconnect it just to rule it out.
Same for any tachometer you have. Disconnect it in case it's got a fault that is hampering the ignition. Does not sound like it though, since you have power to the coil in the ON position but not START.
Makes it sound like the ignition switch.
Paul
You can check the output of the switch and see if the power disappears there or not. Only two wires come out of the single terminal location on the back of the switch that have power in both START and RUN.
In stock wiring form, these are the Green w/red and Red w/green wires. Not sure what color they might be with a different harness.
As said, a neutral safety switch's job is to stop the starter from cranking. Does not normally kill any ignition functions, but again I don't know about all the fancy modern stuff with 33 1/3 wires coming out of the switch on the trans. I can't count higher than four!
Do you still have a wire connected to the "I" post on the starter relay? Do you even have an I post? Modern relay/solenoids do not utilize one, but if you're still using the old style that came with the Broncos it would still be there. You can always make sure it's disconnected so that it can't possibly interfere with spark.
Depends on how yours is wired up, but if it's there then I would disconnect it just to rule it out.
Same for any tachometer you have. Disconnect it in case it's got a fault that is hampering the ignition. Does not sound like it though, since you have power to the coil in the ON position but not START.
Makes it sound like the ignition switch.
Paul
The neutral safety switch is just a dumb normally open switch. If the starter turns over when the transmission is in gear, the switch is either welded shut or it's been bypassed.
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BanditBronco
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Thank you Paul and Lars for the information. I am happy to inform the collective, that I got it fired up last night!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Paul was on the right track, I had one wire incorrect causing my crank no start. Basically I hooked up the "run" wire, which powers the fuse/relay box to the acc. post on the ignition switch. So I was seeing correct voltage everywhere it needed with key on, but losing power to all the relays during cranking. It through me for a loop because the fuel pump acted correctly with key on. Just took a little digging and going back through EFI Guy's videos to remember how the system was supposed to work.
So for anyone with a centech harness, you want to hook Garry's red "run" wire, up to the white wire on your ignition switch.
After a couple weeks of cranking and diagnostics, once I spliced the wire over, it cracked off so quick when I turned the key it surprised me. Decipha's start up tune cold idled as well as my previously tuned mustang set up did warm. I data logged a warm up idle last night for about 20 minutes till it went into closed loop. Tonight I just have to do a few more data logs and send them to Decipha so I can get my corrected fuel tune loaded, then a couple more tuning tweaks and I should be off to the races! or the rocks in my case.
I am looking forward to buttoning this up and getting some road miles on it to see how the transmission is controlled by the explorer since I only have experience driving the 4r70w on a stand alone.
I am stoked to say the least. I hope you guys in Norcal heard me yell "F Yes!!" at the top of my lungs last night at 9:30.
Cheers,
Riley
Paul was on the right track, I had one wire incorrect causing my crank no start. Basically I hooked up the "run" wire, which powers the fuse/relay box to the acc. post on the ignition switch. So I was seeing correct voltage everywhere it needed with key on, but losing power to all the relays during cranking. It through me for a loop because the fuel pump acted correctly with key on. Just took a little digging and going back through EFI Guy's videos to remember how the system was supposed to work.
So for anyone with a centech harness, you want to hook Garry's red "run" wire, up to the white wire on your ignition switch.
After a couple weeks of cranking and diagnostics, once I spliced the wire over, it cracked off so quick when I turned the key it surprised me. Decipha's start up tune cold idled as well as my previously tuned mustang set up did warm. I data logged a warm up idle last night for about 20 minutes till it went into closed loop. Tonight I just have to do a few more data logs and send them to Decipha so I can get my corrected fuel tune loaded, then a couple more tuning tweaks and I should be off to the races! or the rocks in my case.
I am looking forward to buttoning this up and getting some road miles on it to see how the transmission is controlled by the explorer since I only have experience driving the 4r70w on a stand alone.
I am stoked to say the least. I hope you guys in Norcal heard me yell "F Yes!!" at the top of my lungs last night at 9:30.
Cheers,
Riley
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BanditBronco
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Little update, truck has been running really well, I have been driving it to work and enjoying it. Transmission is super happy, and I haven't been able to heat it up past 150 degrees yet. Which is impressive since I was having some issues keeping it cool with the stand alone system. I am currently on my 4th tune from Decipha and it has been a really easy relationship, I would recommend him to anyone. See everyone at KOH! and hopefully the United by Bronco event by Bailie built in March.
What is the part # for that cam sensor? I have 351 and want to use the Explorer harness instead of Mustang but that has been the part that is holding me up. Thanks and congrats on getting fired up.
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BanditBronco
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Todd, Decipha owns efidynotuning.com it is who I went with for ecu tuning.
Cam sensor is from Price Motorsports, it uses a stock cam sensor, either 2 wire or 3 wire depending on your harness and is basically a billet machined stem. It's expensive but a really nice drop in piece. Only other option is a 3.8 sensor, the machined collar that EFI guy usually has stock of, and the longer oil pump rod that has to be installed with the oil pan off. I already had my engine together and wasn't dropping the pan again so I went the easy expensive route with the price motorsports sensor.
Cam sensor is from Price Motorsports, it uses a stock cam sensor, either 2 wire or 3 wire depending on your harness and is basically a billet machined stem. It's expensive but a really nice drop in piece. Only other option is a 3.8 sensor, the machined collar that EFI guy usually has stock of, and the longer oil pump rod that has to be installed with the oil pan off. I already had my engine together and wasn't dropping the pan again so I went the easy expensive route with the price motorsports sensor.
