Painless wire install now dead battery. 73 Bronco

[purkey]

I had a local shop install my Painless wiring harness on my 73 Bronco while I was in California for 10 days. Got it back with only the fuel gauge not reading, take it back they swapped 2 wires and now the fuel gauge works; during the installation, the front turn signal lights (grill) were fried after hookup so they had to get new ones sent to them to finish the job after they discovered a ground after completing the installation; they were working prior to the harness install.

However, tonight I go to get in it and the battery is dead (been driving it since last Saturday afternoon; don't know how old the battery is since the date circles are not marked, I bought the Bronco in January 2016). I do not have the original alternator (it only has one wire coming from it; see pics). It came with this "one wire" when I bought it (reading previous threads, it appears that even 1 wire alt's have 3 wires coming from the alt. However, I do remember only 1 wire coming from the alt prior to the new harness).

I did notice that prior to the new harness, my ammeter read + (charging) when I was driving it. After the install, it was reading - (discharging).
I have attached pics of the wiring. It looks like the wires from the voltage regulator are just turned back and taped into themselves; I do not recall what/where they were routed prior to the new harness.
My questions:
1. did the battery go dead because they did not hook up the other voltage regulator wires?
2. How do I correct the situation
3. What kind of alternator is this? (It has a serpentine belt system, "reverse water pump" (the radiator hoses are on the wrong side from original).

 

[Viperwolf1]

That looks like a GM alternator. There are true 1 wire GM alternators.

You should charge the battery, then measure battery voltage before and after starting to see if it's charging.

There are multiple ways to route the alternator output on the Painless harness. Only one will keep the stock ammeter working.

 

[purkey]

charged it overnight on a 2A trickle (total of 10 hours charging), still dead. After heading to get a battery this morning I will check the output of the alternator. So how do I check the output of the alternator without taking it somewhere. I have a voltmeter.

 

[B RON CO]

Hi, when the engine is running put your meter to DC volts and touch the red lead to the positive battery post and the black lead to negative post. You should see 13.5 to 14.5 volts. Your ammeter is telling you the battery is dischargeing, meaning the Bronco is running on the battery. If you turn your headlights on, incresing the load, the needle should drop more, showing more discharge. An old school test was to start the car and disconnect the negative terminal. If the car runs, the alternator is putting out. You also may have a current draw when turned off which means something is not shutting off, like a door lamp. You should not get any big sparks at the battery terminal when you install your battery. Remember take negative off first and put negative on last. Good luck

 

[SHX669]

I dont know anything about 1 wire Alts - but seems i remember Painless has the wiring schematic for this in their install manual - and i believe it has to wired that way or the alt won't charge the battery.

 

[purkey]

Before buying a battery this morning, I put my voltmeter on the battery and it is reading 13.45-13.5VDC depending on the location of the post. So my thought process is the battery is not dead but I have some other issue now.
Side note: could I be seeing voltage but the Amps are so low it will not turn over the starter? I am mechanical by nature, I leave the sparky stuff to sparkies.

When I got in it last night (when it would not start), the brake indicator light lit up, the radio lit up (aftermarket Alpine), but it would not crank. My neutral safety switch in the gearshifter is loose so I took the key back to off, pushed and held the gear selector up, turned the key to start, nothing (no brake indicator light up, no radio light up, no starter turning over). I assumed dead battery because I noticed the ammeter reading (-) was discharging.
Now that I think I don't have a dead battery where should I be looking? I checked the Painless Maxi-fuse and it is not blown. I checked the connections that I could think of (starter relay (where the battery goes to and starter wire goes to the starter)).

Can't try to start it yet (wife is still asleep), but I did put the key in and turned to ACC, electric fans started but did not sound very smooth running (like it wasn't getting full volts/amps). Turned to start, brake indicator lit up but was not glowing fully.

 

[jeff_gates]

charge the battery and pull all the fuses.
Check your voltage.
if it's not dropping put a fuse in and recheck till you find the circuit that is causing the drain.

 

[Viperwolf1]

I would start by adjusting the NSS.

 

[DirtDonk]

I would never use the old trick of pulling a battery cable with the engine running to test an alternator. Too much chance of expensive damage. Not that expensive, but a needless purchase of a new alternator is still a waste of money.
Many of us have gotten away with it in the past, but enough have messed up theirs that it's not worth it.
Especially if you have a volt-meter which in fact tells you the very same thing, but without the danger part.

Not that this is your problem, but with all the trouble and not little expense of having a shop change an entire wiring harness, why are you still using an obviously old and well used starter cable?
Just not worth the 10 bucks savings. Even if it doesn't effect any of your current issues, I would change it anyway so you won't have to wonder in the future.

Your voltage regulator is not re-used with this GM style alternator. So that's not the issue. There were externally regulated GM alternators too of course, but there would be no reason for using one. And it would use a GM regulator anyway.
So ignore the regulator for the moment and figure out if the current one is charging. As said, with the engine running measure voltage at the battery. Your previous readings of approx. 13.5 is too low by just a bit. Yes, the alternator is charging somewhat, but for a healthy system to work properly you should be seeing 14.5 volts at the battery when the engine is running.
Because most of this type of alternator needs to be running a little faster than idle to get full charge though, hold the RPM level up slightly to say 1500-2000 for a moment to see if the reading comes up. If it does, your alternator is working.
These typically also need to be revved up slightly at first startup just to work normally. So always make sure the engine reaches at least 1500 rpm after the first fire-up to kick in the alternator. Most, if not all of the 1-wire alternators work this way. They're called "self-exciting" alternators.
The rubber plug on the side of yours is either just a cover or a jumper of some kind. There should be two male contacts under there. One is for an indicator lamp and I forget what the other is, but they're usually connected to something in GM applications.

It would not hurt to know more about the alternator with regard to it's output capacity. If it's just a stock one of 70 amps or less, there's no problem running it through the ammeter. But if it's a high-output version with 100, 150 or maybe even 200 amps, do NOT continue to run it this way. It needs it's own dedicated wire directly from the charge post to the battery's positive cable.
So look for any labels, decals or stampings to indicate what it is. If nothing like that is present, you should have it tested to make sure it's not a modified high-output model.
It's probably not, but why take the chance at this point. Right?;D
And since it's polished, it does indicate it might have been messed with in other ways too.

Definitely do what Viper suggested and check/adjust/fix your neutral safety switch. Things like that just wait for the chance to mess with you during a diagnosis of problems.

Good luck.

Paul

 

[purkey]

swapped the Fairlane battery into the Bronco, it fired up. I attached a pic of the different readings of just after startup to after a 15 minute drive around the area.
I did pull the negative off the battery (did not read Dirt's response prior to doing), the Bronco kept running.
Found a sticker on the Bronco battery saying it was manufactured in Feb 2015.

How do you adjust the NSS? My Fairlane is having this issue too.

Thanks also to Tim for helping me why he was at the lake.

 

[purkey]

I checked the alternator for markings and could not find any. This was the alternator that was on the Bronco when I bought it in January 2016. The serpentine belt system was installed in 2013 so I am guessing the alternator was installed at this time but there is no info on it.

 

[Viperwolf1]

swapped the Fairlane battery into the Bronco, it fired up. I attached a pic of the different readings of just after startup to after a 15 minute drive around the area.
I did pull the negative off the battery (did not read Dirt's response prior to doing), the Bronco kept running.
Found a sticker on the Bronco battery saying it was manufactured in Feb 2015.

How do you adjust the NSS? My Fairlane is having this issue too.

Thanks also to Tim for helping me why he was at the lake.

Good news is it's charging. Bad news is it may be overcharging (may have killed the battery). Or it could be a crappy meter.

Here is the NSS adjustment procedure for a trans mounted NSS. If the NSS is on the column you'll have to figure it out.

Loosen the 2 small bolts holding the NSS. Block wheels and place trans in neutral. Insert small pin (1/16" drill bit) in hole in side of NSS. Adjust NSS body back and forth until pin can be pushed into hole approximately 1/2". Tighten NSS bolts.