• Welcome to ClassicBroncos! - You are currently viewing the forums as a GUEST. To take advantage of all the site features, please take a moment to register. It's fast, simple and absolutely free. So please join our community today!
    If you have problems registering or can't log into your account, please contact Admin.

Another Bronco Lean Question

norm02

Full Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2016
Messages
336
Hey guys,

I dropped off my Bronco two weeks ago to have new Energy Suspension bushings installed and I stopped by today to have a look at it since they’ve completed the install and moved on to another repair I’ve asked them to address. I immediately noticed that it’s sitting at least an 1.5” higher on the passenger side and I brought that up to them. The truck’s suspension is original with the exception of Wild Horses shocks front and rear.

They seem to think that the issue is not due to incorrect installation but that it’s because the springs have sagged? The truck sat perfectly level when I brought it to them (see attached “before picture”) so I don’t see how anything other incorrect installation could have caused the new found Bronco Lean.

We had a pretty good disagreement about it and they are going to tear it back down and recheck everything for me which I appreciate it. That being said, am I missing something here?? I didn’t get a “after” picture but it’s the same look as every other Bronco that has Bronco Lean.
 

Attachments

  • E61E54BB-C995-41E0-962C-8255D282EA9F.jpg
    E61E54BB-C995-41E0-962C-8255D282EA9F.jpg
    93.5 KB · Views: 125

AZ73

Contributor
Bronco Guru
Joined
Mar 28, 2012
Messages
3,542
I'm assuming you had the "C" bushings replaced? Ask them if they disconnected the radius arms from the frame when they were installing them. The caps on the "C" bushings have to be tightened with the radius arms touching the ground at the same time (and the "C" bushings have to be installed correctly - the correct side up). Once they're tight, and the arms are both touching the ground evenly, THEN the front axle and arms can be rotated up and put back into the brackets on the frame. If they didn't do that, it will never be level. Before you tell them that, ask them to explain exactly how they installed the bushings. If they don't tell you what I told you, make them do it correctly.
 
OP
OP
norm02

norm02

Full Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2016
Messages
336
I'm assuming you had the "C" bushings replaced? Ask them if they disconnected the radius arms from the frame when they were installing them. The caps on the "C" bushings have to be tightened with the radius arms touching the ground at the same time (and the "C" bushings have to be installed correctly - the correct side up). Once they're tight, and the arms are both touching the ground evenly, THEN the front axle and arms can be rotated up and put back into the brackets on the frame. If they didn't do that, it will never be level. Before you tell them that, ask them to explain exactly how they installed the bushings. If they don't tell you what I told you, make them do it correctly.



Yes, I had the “C” bushings and the Radius Arm bushings replaced. I did not ask them to walk me through how they installed thebuagings but I will if the issue still remains after they do it over again. I forwarded them an article that I found on Wild Horses Website so hopefully they’ll follow it if they hadn’t already.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

bronconut73

Bronco Guru
Joined
Aug 7, 2012
Messages
9,916
If they don't follow the guidelines on the WH web site then get away from them as fast as you can....
They will likely not want to do it "the right way"....but if they don't it will lean again....
 

blubuckaroo

Grease Monkey
Joined
Jun 11, 2007
Messages
11,795
Loc.
Ridgefield WA
I was a hard sell on the idea that the "C" bushings could cause a lean in both the front and rear. In fact I called the Wild Horses instructions a bunch of "hocus pocus."
Now, I've changed my tune. (again)
If you think od the whole connected front axle assembly with the radius arms installed, it is a anti-sway bar. If you clock one end of this bar, it will apply force to the other side.
Some have tried to make sure the radius arms are parallel before tightening the "C" bushings. This will work in a perfect world. But you know what they say about that.
Sometimes, the radius arms have been bent, and sometimes the rear radius arm brackets have been bent.
If you have a front & rear unlevel problem, I'd certainly do some measuring of the donut mounts and check the radius arm straightness before jumping to conclusions.
 
OP
OP
norm02

norm02

Full Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2016
Messages
336
I was a hard sell on the idea that the "C" bushings could cause a lean in both the front and rear. In fact I called the Wild Horses instructions a bunch of "hocus pocus."

Now, I've changed my tune. (again)

If you think od the whole connected front axle assembly with the radius arms installed, it is a anti-sway bar. If you clock one end of this bar, it will apply force to the other side.

Some have tried to make sure the radius arms are parallel before tightening the "C" bushings. This will work in a perfect world. But you know what they say about that.

Sometimes, the radius arms have been bent, and sometimes the rear radius arm brackets have been bent.

If you have a front & rear unlevel problem, I'd certainly do some measuring of the donut mounts and check the radius arm straightness before jumping to conclusions.



It’s not a front & rear unlevel problem its a left & right unlevel problem. There was no issue before they installed the new bushings so I don’t think that I have any components that are bent.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

garberz

Bronco Influencer
Joined
Jun 24, 2007
Messages
6,856
Loc.
Conejo Valley, Ca.
It's easy to get those "C" bushings installed incorrectly. If it didn't have a lean when you dropped it off, they have some "splain'n" to do. Springs sag over time, but not one side more than the other. That's a pretty weak excuse.

Mark
 

jim3326

Bronco Guru
Joined
Jul 12, 2010
Messages
1,781
Loc.
Appleturkey
Not sure if it helped when I replaced mine but I coated the bushings with a bar of soap. It helps with the seating and doesn't make as big of a mess as lube.
 

PaveBronco

Sr. Member
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
912
Not sure if it helped when I replaced mine but I coated the bushings with a bar of soap. It helps with the seating and doesn't make as big of a mess as lube.

Not to highjack...but I am... jim3326 can you post couple of pics of the dash in Frostbite, looks like have a lot of room back there.
 
OP
OP
norm02

norm02

Full Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2016
Messages
336
Not sure if it helped when I replaced mine but I coated the bushings with a bar of soap. It helps with the seating and doesn't make as big of a mess as lube.



I’m not sure what they used when they installed them but that’s good to know regardless. Thanks!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

jim3326

Bronco Guru
Joined
Jul 12, 2010
Messages
1,781
Loc.
Appleturkey
Not to highjack...but I am... jim3326 can you post couple of pics of the dash in Frostbite, looks like have a lot of room back there.

Yeah, it's kind of super-modified.
 

Attachments

  • Dash1.jpg
    Dash1.jpg
    65.2 KB · Views: 91
  • Dash2.jpg
    Dash2.jpg
    61.3 KB · Views: 81
  • Dash3.jpg
    Dash3.jpg
    81.7 KB · Views: 92
  • Dash4.jpg
    Dash4.jpg
    65 KB · Views: 94
OP
OP
norm02

norm02

Full Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2016
Messages
336
So they called me just now and said that they took it all apart and put it back together step by step according to the Wild Horses document I sent him and here was no change. I asked him if they made sure the “C” bushings weren’t installed in the wrong place and if they tightened it up using the right sequence and he said they did.

He offered to replaced the front springs at no cost to see if that makes any difference so I told him to go for it. I’ll be interested to see if that fixes the issue and they think it could be possible that the old bushings had disintegrated so badly that it could have sat properly with a sagging spring on one side. He said it’s an inch off from being even.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
OP
OP
norm02

norm02

Full Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2016
Messages
336
Nope.
They just did it wrong again.
Guarantee it.



I think you’re probably right and the good thing is that it will still be uneven with new springs if that’s the case.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
OP
OP
norm02

norm02

Full Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2016
Messages
336
The old bushings were the original ones and they were SHOT so maybe he’s on to something but I kind of doubt it. Pics below
 

Attachments

  • A2F46662-1251-4760-8BD7-8D717FA111E1.jpg
    A2F46662-1251-4760-8BD7-8D717FA111E1.jpg
    70 KB · Views: 87
  • A4CA0DD1-ED50-489E-A394-E634269323F5.jpg
    A4CA0DD1-ED50-489E-A394-E634269323F5.jpg
    105.3 KB · Views: 87
  • 7DADB0C5-32AF-4400-9F0D-F5900154BC50.jpg
    7DADB0C5-32AF-4400-9F0D-F5900154BC50.jpg
    121.5 KB · Views: 87
  • D09E7E43-9C7D-4954-8482-9A4D6786A031.jpg
    D09E7E43-9C7D-4954-8482-9A4D6786A031.jpg
    51.6 KB · Views: 79
  • 5685E948-2A32-4E6C-8C55-CA0E77F33E3A.jpg
    5685E948-2A32-4E6C-8C55-CA0E77F33E3A.jpg
    83.4 KB · Views: 80
Last edited:
OP
OP
norm02

norm02

Full Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2016
Messages
336
I’d be willing to bet that they didn’t take it apart and that they’re just wanting to try this first since it will be much easier to swap springs than it will be to completely disassemble and reassemble the front end. It took them several days to get the old ones off and the new ones on last time and all of the sudden they were able to disassemble it and reassemble it in less than a work day this time around??


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

blubuckaroo

Grease Monkey
Joined
Jun 11, 2007
Messages
11,795
Loc.
Ridgefield WA
It’s not a front & rear unlevel problem its a left & right unlevel problem. There was no issue before they installed the new bushings so I don’t think that I have any components that are bent.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What i'm referring to is how an out of spec radius arm will make the whole car unlevel.
What it's doing is forcing one side up and the other side down. Since the donut bracket is so far back, the whole side (front and back) are affected.
The rear is affected more on extended radius arms since the rear bracket is further back.
 
OP
OP
norm02

norm02

Full Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2016
Messages
336
What i'm referring to is how an out of spec radius arm will make the whole car unlevel.

What it's doing is forcing one side up and the other side down. Since the donut bracket is so far back, the whole side (front and back) are affected.

The rear is affected more on extended radius arms since the rear bracket is further back.



I see what you’re saying and that makes sense but if one of the Radius Arms was bent wouldn’t it have sat uneven with the factory bushings too?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

blubuckaroo

Grease Monkey
Joined
Jun 11, 2007
Messages
11,795
Loc.
Ridgefield WA
I see what you’re saying and that makes sense but if one of the Radius Arms was bent wouldn’t it have sat uneven with the factory bushings too?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes.
I'm wondering if the new bushings are in right side up.
I've had some where the top and bottom markings weren't legible. I had to measure and remark them before installing them.
 
Top